Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

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dcunited4life
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby dcunited4life » Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:22 am

Wish I was nearby so I could swing through and check this out with ya. Been struggling with my P since I got it. Doesn't help that the PO obviously dogged the fuck outta it.

As previous posters stated it is not necessary to remove the engine to replace the exhaust. In my experience, it is far far easier to get the exhaust back on with the engine removed, but again, not necessary. I was so frustrated trying to get my exhaust back on and get the thread to line up on the bolt I probably could have much more easily dropped the engine and done so than spent 1-2 hours (breaks for beer obviously) screwing with it.

Hope it comes together for ya so I can see this thing at the Rally....I'll be in my car unfortunately carrying Dwayne's broke ass around and all you jerks parts.......at least I'll be able to buy anything I need at the swap to bring home to the P!

epsato
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby epsato » Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:26 am

Worst case I'll ride the PX up, but a 150 just feels too slow for long rides. I don't mind being the last one because of a loud stereo, but because I'm the slowest? No fun!

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Zeets
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby Zeets » Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:47 am

If you put air in your tires, your bike would keep up with the rest.

I rode your PX on the long ride at the Bulls Rally, being slow is the least of your problems, the shaky loose steering bearings and the utter lack of a manageable front brake would be of greater concern.

I kept pace with the front group of bikes, two-up, inspite of all the other difficulties, admittedly, the bike was faster and handled better after I put the tires to proper pressure.
Zayretow

70' Vespa Sprint (2009 LML power)
74' Yamaha RD350 (pinger)
2008 Suzuki DRZ-400SM (thumper)

epsato
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby epsato » Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:51 am

Column bearings, that's a language I don't speak yet. Obviously I can't do them before NSP, but are they hard to replace?

The brake's even more confusing. I took it to the shop several times asking for it to get looked at and was always told it was fine. It seems to lock up only when it's wet. But I've also heard the disc brakes are a pain to work on.

I rode up to NSP with proper tire pressure and still couldn't keep up with all the p200s and rally 180s on the ride. The PX does fine up to about 53 to maybe 55, but is red lining at that point.

hurleybt
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby hurleybt » Tue Oct 02, 2012 1:13 pm

Throw a kit on it. You gotta put this on your stereo at least once this weekend.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_kIUSr7-is

epsato
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby epsato » Tue Oct 02, 2012 1:20 pm

I'd thought about it, but a kit's like $300 and it makes the engine less reliable. I've limited tools and even more limited talent/skill/knowledge.

Ideal's to find some wrecked p200 with a cheap but usable engine and swap it.

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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby epsato » Wed Oct 03, 2012 12:11 pm

UPDATE:

Last night I took off the carb, found and fixed the leak. Special thanks to Matt Toigo for giving me a spare hose clamp. With the carb solidly on, I got great compression. The hole in the old exhaust may have been robbing this P of some pressure.

I replaced both gear shift cables, then replaced the rear brake cable. The clutch cable got re-attached. The rear brake cable was a total basketcase (inner and outer) so I replaced the whole thing. Low and behold, this particular P uses the old style brake cable! Thankfully I still had one lying about.

What's left:

All that's left are a few cosmetic changes (installing long stem mirrors), refill the air in the rear tire (was deflated to take out and to make the exhaust replacement easier.

The replacement bulb for the turn signal didn't light up, so I've also got to dig into the cowl to figure out what's wrong. It was previously working, so it's got to be a loose wire.

The big "to do" is that I need to dial in the carb. For some reason, this always stumps me. I did the standard 3 turns for the mixture screw, and 8 for the idle set screw, then adjusted until it sounded "right." But whenever I do that, the next day it won't start! I'm going to try it again tonight, but wanted to see if anyone could come by and help me out with it.

Once this is done, I'll have my rally scoot ready to roll!



Oh, yes, I need to "Dial in" the carb. I got it running strong last night, but dialing in is an art I can't seem to get the hang of. Anyone going to be near Logan's Circle this evening with a few minutes to spare to help me do some dialing?

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dcunited4life
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby dcunited4life » Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:09 pm

hurleybt wrote:Throw a kit on it. You gotta put this on your stereo at least once this weekend.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_kIUSr7-is


I would agree on both counts....trow a kit on dat bbiaaach! I feel like I'm living back in Baltimore again....

Top end rebuild is an hour or two job + a little port matching. Buy me beer/gas and we'll do it. If you do a P200 motor then you may start running into problems matching up the electrical system....don't ask me how I know. Apparently the DR180 kit is pretty reliable and requires next to no port matching. P200 motor does sound cool too though I must admit. Let's discuss over zombies....I have nothing better to do all day at NSP since I'll be without scooter. New song Idea.....TROW A HITCH ON DAT BITCH. yea I need that. towing.

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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby epsato » Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:16 pm

There may be hope. If I can get the p200 solid tonight (all signs are looking good), then I'd have a PX to share. Thus, if the P200's running, and if you can find a way to get it from DC to NSP (perhaps ride the PX and have Dwayne drive the car), you can always use my PX and ride up, at least partially (DC to G'burg and back).

"there's always money in the banana stand."

It's looking like the P200's going to be in good enough shape to ride up this weekend, tonight's dial in and test ride will confirm whether or not it's a good idea!


BTW, I wrote to the "KIT ON THAT BEACH" guy and offered him a free stereo kit for his moped. He never got back to me.

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dcunited4life
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby dcunited4life » Wed Oct 03, 2012 2:29 pm

Thanks for the offer...I don't know if I trust Dwayne with my car...lol. Plus Gettysburg is 45 min from my parents house in Loudoun, which I think we will swing by for snacks and to raid dad's beer fridge rather than drive through DC...I know the beltway is fun and all on Friday but I'm not that big of a masochist.

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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby epsato » Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:09 am

Update:

Good news: I replaced the broken turn signal as all attempts to source the problem were unsuccessful. It works like a charm now.

Bad news: The rear brake cable disconnected at the pedal. I'll replace it tonight. Does anyone have a photo of the P Series brake pedal with the cable connected? I wasn't sure if there should be cable beyond the hole or if it's supposed to just fit into the hole and stop there.

Odd to me, as the P series usually has the "loop" set up, but this P does not.

The other problem was with the carb. I dialed it in, but the engine still "races" on me. I must have dialed it in wrong.

I know racing's often a symptom of an air leak. But it CAN be caused by improper dialing in, right?

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Zeets
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby Zeets » Thu Oct 04, 2012 10:58 am

If you pull the choke and it settles down, its likely an air leak.

Unless your throttle cable isn't returning all the way, or isn't seated properly.

If it didn't have an airleak last week before you started this debacle, chances are it hasn't developed one.

Or, you twisted the idle adjustment in too far. Remember, you can't adjust a cold engine properly, it needs to be at a running temp.
Zayretow

70' Vespa Sprint (2009 LML power)
74' Yamaha RD350 (pinger)
2008 Suzuki DRZ-400SM (thumper)

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dcunited4life
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby dcunited4life » Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:11 am

Carb was removed then cleaned and reattached? Air leak under the airbox maybe? I've got some spare gaskets I can bring this weekend for ya. You got the oil injection hooked up right? If not and it's an injected carb that'll be a leak right there.

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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby epsato » Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:38 am

It's oil injected and I did put a new gasket on. I don't think the throttle's sticking, which was one of my first thoughts...

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Mikeh
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Re: Stupid Question RE: P Series carb Rebuild

Postby Mikeh » Thu Oct 04, 2012 12:06 pm

When you say "races" do you mean that it idles high?

or that it revs high and low randomly?

or that after you accelerate and let off the throttle that the engine speed increases or stays high?

If it's just idling high then adjust the idle with the adjustment screw on the top of the carb and/or check the adjuster where the cable comes into the carb tub. Also FYI when adjusting the cable at the tub you want the carb slide to just reach the fully open postion (when looking down the bore of the carb) but not stress the cable when you are at wide open throttle. If the adjuster is out too far or the cable is not installed correctly then you will have tension on the cable when the throttle is turned all the way to the stop at the headset.

If the engine races after you accelerate or after you are going at higher RPMs before settling back down then i suggest you check your timing with a timing light.

If the idle seems to be doing random stuff and the engine won't stay running at idle very well then you may have an airleak. Especially is this problem is solved when you pull the choke out.


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